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Post by Marnark on Jun 4, 2011 17:22:40 GMT -5
D'ero was taking a whole new tack now. He was talking about moving the Northern population South. A'lez sighed heavily. "Son, the problem with plans like that, is they are idealogical. Yes, in theory, it's all sound and good and grand. Might even work. In theory. The problem is that bad blood stays bad. Cultures stay the same. In small shots, like your little group, Northerners can be integrated into the South. But if you start moving people down here wholesale, then we have problems. Fights will break out. Over space, food, all of it. Perceived rights. Culture clashes. It is the nature of people. Not to mention that everyone here is here because the North kicked us out a long time ago. And now you are asking them to open their homes to those very people."
A'lez shook his head and sighed. "Children are the best bet, not so set in their ways. They can grow up here, saving family lines if you see it that way. But learn our culture, maybe Impress, maybe not. Integrate. But no, moving entire Holds is going to be out of the question. The idea is grand and all, done with a heart of gold. But that isn't going to make it all hunky-dory."
The sad truth was that the North had made their bed, now they were going to have to sleep in it. No matter what the South did, in extended an unwarranted and undeserved hand of good faith, this was all going to end very badly.
"Don't get me wrong. We are going to do what we can, when we can. But it is like trying to stop a river and rescue termites with a singlar log. If you catch my drift." Thread and the population both were going to be problems and drains on the Weyrs. Infighting, back biting, the desperate clawing of people trying to be the ones to survive ... not to mention the drain on resources. Pern was just not ready for this. At least - the human population of Pern was not ready for this. There was going to be a massive culling no matter what happened. Whether the South refused aid to the North, whether the South and North started killing each other for supplies and safety, or any number of other things.
"We will do what we can, D'ero. But that is all we can do. We can help, but not at the expense of our own lives." A'lez stated. "I will not lead wings into a situation I am not certain I can lead them back out of more or less intact. They trust me, and I owe them that. Yes, it is the dragon man's duty to protect the Holds. But we are too few to protect them all. We will protect our own, and in any spare breath we get, we will try to extend a slight shelter to those who have none. If they live. The point in our going North is to find out who it is that will accept this hand, and who will bite the hand. The rest of it, we already know the outcome."
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Post by Ise on Jun 12, 2011 11:45:01 GMT -5
“I’m not talking about moving enter holds here, I know that’s not possible. A handful of people from different holds and cotholds. We can’t just limit it to children though. Our crafts have advanced far more then the ones in the South have, we’ve had time to sit around and experiment with new techniques while the South has been forced to struggle to survive. As good as C’mar is in blacksmithing, a master smith or even a journeyman is going to know more though, and they’ll be too old to Impress, they’ll actually be able to devote their time to working and teaching. We’re going to need more women as well. Ones that aren’t going to be interested in Impress. I don’t know if it’s true for the whole South or if its just in the Weyr but most of the women here don’t seem interested in having children. And I don’t mean to be crude but women and their childbearing abilities are going to become more important then most other things if Pern suffers from such a culling.”
He got up from the chair he had been sitting in and started to pace a bit, running a hand through his dark hair as he thought. “Even if you didn’t bring people from the North down you’re still going to have fights breaking out over food, space and anything else that can be fought over. People are going to panic. If Thread wasn’t bad enough, you’ve still got the Holdless who are going to find a way to keep hitting the smaller places. Even if people from the North are never brought here, more buildings and homes need to be made and more food needs to be gathered and stored. Doing that will at least help ease peoples minds.”
The brown rider scowled a little and folded his hands behind his back as he continued pacing. The social interactions between people from the North and South held little interest for him. It was the bloodlines and other traits that concerned him. He found it difficult to understand why there was still so much tension between North and South. Until he had been sent South, he had never given much thought to it or the Dragon riders that may or may not have been there. There were far more important things for him to be spending his time on. Nor did he think his family had ever brooded on the subject before. Oh he had remembered the lesson when they had gone over the tyrannical riders being sent South thanks to the work of the brave High Lords but even then D’ero had never bought that whole story, he had always been suspicious of people in power. “Shards. This whole South vs. North thing is crap. Nobody alive now had anything to do with it. Now people are all going to get themselves killed and weaken blood lines just because they’re too stupid and stubborn to let go of something.”
D’ero suddenly returned to his seat and fell back in it, letting out a frustrated sigh. A’lez was right and that was the worst of it. The man was doing what had to be done for the greater good, he wasn’t just doing this because he disliked the North. He knew he would continued to think and brood over this, even if it was hopeless he couldn’t just give up. Unless he found some way to make dragons magical though, he knew there was nothing he’d be able to do. “Can we at least give a copy of these maps to the people in the North. At least give them a chance to find shelter when Thread Fall starts?”
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Post by Marnark on Jun 12, 2011 17:46:03 GMT -5
A'lez heard D'ero out, fully understanding the frustration the youth was dealing with. In still silence, he waited for D'ero to run out of steam. He really couldn't say that he didn't agree with the lad, but his handle on reality still insisted that it wouldn't work. Human nature was too vile when all heaped together. Singly, one on one, North and South could work beautifully. But trying to move people en mass was going to be a recipe for disaster. Shards, the Northerners weren't getting along with themselves right now. Not if there was a civil war brewing.
"I see your point. But mine remains valid." A'lez answered. "If we do this, it will be a long, slow process. And we're going to have to split the Notherners up as far as we can. We don't want them banding together down here, for that is only going to breed problems. As for your concerns about the women, don't worry about it. We wouldn't still be here if they weren't reproducing. It is only the dragonriding women that are off that roster - and there really aren't very many of those. And it's more a side effect of between than any personal preference." It was a strange thought, to think that D'ero had been going around asking women if they would have a baby. What in the world was he doing that for anyway?
"The infighting over food and supplies will only be in the North. Holds here don't have that problem. Yes, we have a problem with raiding Holdless, but that's not even the same thing. It's not even driven by thread fall. So far as expanding goes, I again agree with you. But who is going to do this building? We are far too busy to break off and do it, and your people won't even begin to know how. Things here are done differently, due to the climate. Building Northern style here will only suffocate the people that try to live in it." A'lez pointed out.
"The main problem, if you set aside the differences between the two cultures, is logistics. And believe me when I tell you I've been doing logistics ever since I Impressed. It's a big thing, and multiple facets impact the same angle. It all has to be considered. More is going into this than just a reshuffling of people. Children eat less and take less space. They can be taught as they grow. Given the new culture. Children are both male and female, and certainly only a select few will be used as Candidates. I am talking about children in the Holds, not here. Children fostered to Southern families. These stand the highest chance of actually making it.
"The problem with older people is, yes, they're educated. They're also set in their ways and have a lifetime of hate behind them. We really aren't prepared to handle that. Right now our current problem and concern is not in preserving whatever knowledge advancements they might have, but in saving as many lives as we can. This includes not sparking fatal fights here once they're moved. We have enough knowledge to live comfortably, to do what we have to do. Whatever was discovered can be rediscovered at a later date if we have to. It is a secondary concern. We cannot have our pie and eat it too, D'ero. Any written material can be easily moved. Given the nature of how you and your peers adjusted, we can take small shots of journeymen in the crafts. I'm sorry, but your Masters are liable to have to stay behind."
A'lez tapped the table top with a pointed finger. "And, without any wavering, if anyone who comes here to seek safety starts causing problems by inciting infighting between North and South for those ancient political reason? They will be shipped back North regardless of their talents or age. It is over and done and we can't afford yet another hostile front."
"We can probably gather a lot of the wild fruits that the jungles have to offer and ship them north to help alleviate the shortages. But even that is going to be twig against the tide." A'lez told him. "While the food supplies the South has to offer is vast, it is also completely seasonal and limited by the number of hands we can assign to gather it."
"So far as the maps go, they are too detailed to accurately copy in any kind of useful time frame to offer them any assistance. Much less in the quantity of copies you are referring to. However, we could probably send word to them. More like weather reports to those whom it concerns as it is to happen. That, we can do. Flitters are fast and usually reliable."
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Post by Ise on Jun 17, 2011 18:21:33 GMT -5
D’ero appreciated the fact that A’lez let him ramble on and finish all his thoughts. The Weyrleader had clearly spent a lot of time thinking this over and could probably counter every argument D’ero might have come up with before he had gotten a sentence or two into it. That just made him even more depressed.
He did have to chuckle softly as A’lez claimed it was just the side effect of going Between that kept more women at the Weyr having children. “I dare you to suggest to the Dragon Shield women that they should go have children. It may just be me though that thinks the women in the Weyr are less willing to have children. The women here are far more… independent then the ones I was use to in the North.”
D’ero shrugged a little as A’lez pointed out that only the North would be in such a panic over things like food and supplies. He found it hard to believe that the general population of the South wouldn’t tried to horde things but maybe they were already prepared for Thread Fall. Of course Thread was already falling, so by now they had probably gotten over their panic. “The people in the holds can start working on buildings, maybe send whatever candidates don’t Impress to help out or speak with the Weyrling Master to try and figure out a way to tie it into a lesson or something. And when Northerners are moved down here, they can learn how to help out. It’ll give them something to do, a way to keep busy and stop themselves from dwelling on what’s going on. It would also give them a chance to integrate better with the Southerners.”
The brown rider shook his head a little but didn’t interrupt A’lez as he explained his reasons for only bringing children over. He could agree with most of them but had a harder time with some of them. “Look for older baseborn people, not the ones born in the Holds. And actually talk to people before you start thinking that we all have some deep rooted hate for the South and the dragon riders. I doubt I’m the only person who never gave the South a second thought. We learned our lessons, the riders were just some tyrants trying to take over and keep everything for themselves. After that I had more important things to think about then waste my time hating something I couldn’t even picture. Who cares about dragons and their riders when one early frost could kill off all the crops and leave you starving for half the winter.” He said nothing when it came to leaving Craft Masters behind in the North. D’ero thought it was foolish to leave them without speaking to them first, but he did know that A’lez didn’t have time to go and chat with everyone in the North. They would not be able to hand pick each person that was allowed to go South.
“I assume that even Southerners will be shipped North if they are the ones to start a fight correct?” D’ero thought it slightly less likely that a fight would be started by a Northerner. He could not think of many people who were dumb enough to start a fight when they were out numbered a hundred to one.
“Bringing food would probably be more symbolic then an actual way to fight off hunger. It would help show that the South is truly interested in helping, not just performing the duties that come with being a rider. And every little bit helps, even if it doesn’t seem like much.”
He nodded, agreeing with A’lez’s way to alert the Northern holds to incoming Thread Fall. Yes, flitters would work just fine for that and it would take less work, no one would have to try and copy the maps. It made him wish he had a flitter of his own to help out with.
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Post by Marnark on Jun 18, 2011 21:00:32 GMT -5
A'lez laughed outright at D'ero's statement. "I dare say that the Shield are a whole other brand of Human from most folk. Both the men and women. I fancy even Shield men are scared of the women unbridled." He answered, highly aware that D'ero fancied one such woman. The kid had balls. Big ones. To even want to get to know a woman like that, much less get so close to one as he had. But love did strange things to a fellow, and A'lez knew love when he saw it. "Independent does not mean unwilling to bear children. It just means less subservient, less dependent on someone else to do things. It balances out." He added, but shrugged. Maybe the whole reason D'ero thought that was because he'd already asked his Shiled girl about babies. Nooooot the best place to go looking for such things, really. No one was as devoted to their job as the Shield. And babies just didn't mesh well with what the Shield did. "I hope you do realize that you've picked probably the most independent woman on the whole globe to consort with, right?" A'lez asked. He had no idea what cloud D'ero was living in, but A'lez knew that if it came down to it, where hard choices had to be made ... D'ero would be dropped cold as a rock. A'lez only hoped that day never came, where choices of that nature would never have to be made.
"The only problem with assigning the Holders to do these things, is that the Holders are already busy all the time. Providing goods and food and things of that nature to support not only their own families all year, but us too. Because we don't have time to do that. They really don't have spare time in spades. In which comes the problem. Food grows on trees, yes. But someone has to go pick it." A'lez reminded. "You were a Holder, surely you remember how much work it was day in and day out just to do your normal job. The Northerners can do a lot of work, yes. And true, a few southerners can guide them. But this entails putting lots of Northerners together in the same place, of a workable age. Both of these things I am not willing to do. Northerners need to be scattered abroad, to better integrate. I am also still of the opinion that younger is better. But younger also means less workable."
"Don't worry. I will certainly talk to folk. This is all plans in mutable fashion. But I do have reasons for what I've already cooked up." A'lez answered, rising to his feet once again and patting D'ero on the shoulder. "I understand your concern and pressure for trying to make more happen faster, sooner, better. I really do. I sympathize. But on the same tack, I have to look out for my own at the same time."
He thought about the whole southern/northern thing for a moment, and sighed, shaking his head slightly. He didn't bother to elaborate on his thoughts, knowing it would only bother D'ero more. It was neither here nor there. No, Southerners would not be sent North. It was the Northerners that stood to lose their chance at safety if they acted up. If Southerners did start problems beyond reason, they would be disciplined. But not sent North. The North was already in dire straights, why add to it?
"Symbolic is all we can offer at the moment. Maybe the good will will plant seed and grow, erasing most of our problems. Faranth help us if anything else goes wrong." he glanced over at the wall where the candles were burning, and heaved a sigh. "I am glad you could talk with me, D'ero. But I have a meeting to get to. I will be in contact with you soon about our venture Northward, alright?" he extended a hand toward D'ero in farewell and good will. "We'll get this sorted out to the best good we can manage."
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Post by Ise on Jun 29, 2011 22:30:35 GMT -5
D’ero opened and shut his mouth, unsure what to say to A’lez about Jarshan. Talking about his relationship with her was one thing, talking about it to the Weyrleader of all people was something different. Discussing his girlfriend was something to be done with friends, not people who gave you orders. “Yes. I know. It’s one of the many reasons why I like her. I was never interested in a woman that needed to be coddled all the time, even less so when I Impressed to Horuth. Someone like Jarshan was a refreshing change from most of the women I knew in the North.”
“We have people and dragons here. Drop a few off at the holds for a few hours a day or even just a week to help out. We have candidates that won’t Impress that’ll be able to do that. If they’re getting supplies for us we should be helping out as well. Even if it’s only a half dozen people. It’ll at least keep people busy.”
The hint of a frown touched his lips as he worried that A’lez would completely separate any kids that were brought in from the North from each other. D’ero had never been close friends with most of those from the Expedition but knowing that they were there had always been nice. When he felt homesick he at least had had a few others who knew the same landmarks and would have felt slightly claustrophobic by all the trees. “Just make sure you leave the kids together in small groups. Otherwise I think you’ll end up having a different sort of problem.”
The brown rider bit the inside of his lip and nodded to A’lez. Of course he was going to try to do what was best. He didn’t have the personal connections to the North so he had a much less emotional, and probably more logical, response to what was happening. “I understand that you’re doing the best you can with what you have, even if I seem a bit impatience to do something about this.” No, sitting around and not doing something wasn’t something D’ero cared for. When there was a problem he liked to take care of it as soon as he could, not wait for others to talk about it before taking votes on it and then finally deciding what to do about it.
Even if they couldn’t do much for the North, symbolism would be better then nothing. And even being able to help just one or two people would be better then nothing. Not much better but he had to try and stay positive. “Thank you for hearing me out sir. I’ll be sure to talk to N’var soon.” He took the Weyrleader’s offered hand, giving it a firm shake before taking his leave.
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